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> I miss the days when the Republican party was led by a President like Bush, who told America that Islam is a religion of peace.

As an ex-Muslim, I can assure you that Islam is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a religion of peace.

And you seem to be forgetting that Bush was a warmongerer who killed millions of innocents. I hope you are not endorsing the horrors he wrought.


I don't have exact numbers but my understanding is/was the US-led wars into Iraq and Afghanistan didn't cause millions of deaths but the insurrections against the governments established afterwards did. Iraqis killing other Iraqis, Afghans killing other Afghans.

Bush might have been the one who toppled the existing equilibrium of Saddam Hussein and the Taliban, but most of the suffering was inflicted by the bloody civil wars (often fueled by third parties such as Iran).


You break it, you bought it. You get zero points for invading a country for no good reason and saying you’re going to bring freedom and democracy while having no realistic plan for actually doing it.


> Islam is not, by any stretch of the imagination, a religion of peace.

It is. The word Islam and Salaam are etymologically tied to the word "peace".

If your definition of peace is "never wages war", well there's no country or political regime in the world like that. Even India, which was liberated by the famous nonviolent philosopher Gandhi, did not last many years without needing to wage war and take territory.

Islam is the only remaining religion with a political element and an existing desire for statehood. You could argue for Judaism (but some of the Orthodox would disagree) also. Back when Christendom had aspirations of statehood, it was also not "peaceful" in the way most people imagine. But this isn't a feature of the religions. It's a feature of world politics. No one can be peaceful and engage meaningfully in world politics. Everyone is propped up by some army somewhere.

You can have many arguments against the social regime, views on gender, etc. Etc. of Islam, but to say it's not peaceful because it is a political entity is just not understanding politics or the world, imo


> Islam is the only remaining religion with a political element and an existing desire for statehood

What do you mean by this? There are several countries that declare themselves to be Islamic.


I'm reasonably sure the GP is referring to the fact that there are explicitly political aspects to Islam (wanting an Islamic state) that don't exist in other religions.

I'm not sure I agree though, as Judaism now has a state and Christianity had one and lost it.


I mentioned "remaining" as the explicit political aspects are in all religions, it's just that as we came to modernity states became secular, and only Islam remains with that element still largely in tact.

I did mention the Jewish state as well, but imo, since it is based partly on ethnicity even for open non-believers, it's kind of a mix between a secular and a religious state


Yes, that is pretty much what I mean. But the idea of a unified Muslim state is also still pretty alive in the world. In a way it's not in other religions (Judaism is an interesting edge case, imo)



it means danger to the non-believer


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